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Post by Bull66 on Apr 20, 2006 9:38:43 GMT -5
How do you feel about the new style of department operations???
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Post by sinks on Apr 20, 2006 14:29:48 GMT -5
Seems like its gonna be tough on our truck co. They go out twice a year, where as the engines go out once, ( 2 at a time ).
The other side is that training should keep you on your toes. Everyone knows how relaxed we get when its going to be dwelling, garden apts, tower. each year.
Its also another night of filling bottles, maybe people will learn how to conserve their air. As in not sucking down a bottle on the backup line out in the street.
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Post by fow on Apr 20, 2006 15:09:24 GMT -5
The theory is if you know what kind of fire you are responding to everytime, the emotions don't rise as they would in a REAL fire. Having to think on your feet and react to the type of building, location and quantity of the fire and postioning you will have your hands and mind full as you would when the bell goes off at home. There are a number of changes this year and they are going to put your skills to a test and will hopefully humble you a bit in regard to complacency. I would encourage you to try and make a school when the temp is up around 90 with high humidity to get a feel for the effects of weather if you have not done so before. The Garden Apartments and the Tower will give you a good barometer of how out of or in shape you are  . Good motivator to put down the Ice Cream and get back on the treadmill. Stay Safe and HYDRATE the summer is upon us.  |
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Post by squad5 on Apr 23, 2006 9:33:12 GMT -5
I guess that when you have to move 50 plus firefighters, rigs etc and still cover your own district without even knowing what drill you are doing is a good thing? How come we are all doing what the academy wants instead of the academt doing what we the fire service that they are supposed to train want. Is this abaout their ego or training our members. I would hate to send my tower ladder to a LPG fire and then need it for a real job! Maybe its just me!
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 23, 2006 11:33:27 GMT -5
What the hell are you talking about?!?
The academy is putting you on evolutions which YOU WILL DO IN REAL LIFE AT SOME POINT. They may not be perfect, they may not be complete reality, but you are there to train. Getting a little taste of someting that you may not see very often is the best training of all. House fires, b.s. small taxpayer fires an such are all bread and butter work. It's nice to do a little something different every now and then to keep your brain working.
If you don't like the way that they do it, just stay home.
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Post by squad5 on Apr 23, 2006 15:26:40 GMT -5
Why don't you calm down. Nobody trains more than I do. Nobody understands its value also. All I am saying is that taking a very large part of your Department half way across Long Island is an undertaking and I don't feel that with what specific use equipment (Rescue, tower ladder, aerial)it is smart to send it out of town because it "might" be needed. If we send somthing that is not going to be used, you are not protecting the people at home. Send what is needed.
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Post by pwlt3a on Apr 23, 2006 16:06:20 GMT -5
I concur with Squad5. Adding new evolutions is a great idea. However, Grumpy I think your missing the point. This new idea of NOT telling you what evolution you will be doing that night is not a good idea because you will need to bring all of your apparatus there in order to be prepared to do the evolution. When we get toned out for a call we don't roll everything and then decide what we are going to use. We should be given some type of heads up so that for example, we do auto extrication, then we can make sure that we have our Heavy Rescue going that night. Other than the fact that we know that we are going to do auto extrication is enough to make me stay on my toes to see what they might throw at us.
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Post by liteurfire994 on Apr 23, 2006 17:51:37 GMT -5
why not call in some m/a for the three hours you'll be at the academy. i know long beach does it. we do it for parades and installations, why not get 1-1-1 to sit for us when we leave to go train?
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 23, 2006 18:03:28 GMT -5
Not even a need to have someone sit on standby. Just make an auto mutual aid agreement for the few hours that the trucks will be out of town. That's how many places do it.
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Post by squad5 on Apr 23, 2006 18:08:28 GMT -5
it matters where you are. I happen to live in an area surrounded by water. auto mutual aid would take to long to get to me. Thats why i dont want to send rigs to Bethpage without actually needing them.
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Post by Billy Buff on Apr 23, 2006 18:33:53 GMT -5
You guys in Nassau have no idea how lucky you are to have the training academy that you have. I would give anything to train at the NCFA. Not saying Suffolk is nothing or bad but it sure isn't the NCFA.
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 23, 2006 18:52:23 GMT -5
It's also not out in the middle of nowhere... unlike yaphank.
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Post by finster on Apr 23, 2006 20:15:32 GMT -5
Have to agree with Squad5 on this one.. Especially knowing his district, you're talking a MINIMUM of 10 minutes for a truck to make Mutual aid in there, and if it's on the Northern most point of the district (which generates a good number of runs), you're talking AT LEAST 15 minutes from the closest Mutual aid firehouse to make it there. It's also not out in the middle of nowhere... unlike yaphank. |
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 23, 2006 20:24:43 GMT -5
So what would you like... a portable fire academy so they bring the classes to you?
It's called change. The academy is changing to try something new. If this change isn't good for you, then your chiefs should be contacting the academy to tell them what will work.
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Post by fow on Apr 23, 2006 20:57:08 GMT -5
Sq5; Your issue of stripping the town is valid. Why then did you make it a different issue with your initial post, i.e. " their ego". And making a statement that "nobody trains more than you" immediately categorizes YOU as the "ego" problem with your post. IF you have an issue with your geography and your reponse being affected by the new policy at the FSA, I highly suggest you speak to Chief M., ChiefB., of the other Chief M. I will bet you $100 that if you present the issues you are facing by having your apparatus depleted because you are "surrounded by water" and isolated as you suggest to ANY of these men, they will work with you to make your problems minimal. To fire off a rocket hot from the hip and make remarks as to the system and it being a mental blow job for the chiefs there and the services available to your department for training is pretty pathetic. I would seriously re-think your delivery. I'll let you know where to mail the check. |
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Post by pwlt3a on Apr 23, 2006 21:31:12 GMT -5
The deal with automatic mutual aid and standby companies is not solving the problem of taking out pieces of apparatus that DON'T HAVE TO LEAVE THE DISTRICT. If we know that the evolution is not going to warrant the Tower Ladder then why put that huge piece of apparatus on the road. I just find it a little crazy to bring all our apparatus out there to guess and see what we are going to do.
Billy Buff, I don't think that anyone has a problem with the Fire Academy. I will admit that I have not been to any other academies but the chiefs know a lot and they do help point out ways in which we can better our fire fighting ability. But showing up to evolutions without any idea is not conducive to everyone.
And Grumps....Change is good....but this change needs to be tweaked.
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Post by PWFD1115 on Apr 23, 2006 22:35:05 GMT -5
For a signal 9 you roll an ambulance, for a fire call you roll engines and ladders, and for a rescue call the rescue goes. You can expect to do a big auto extrication job with a tower ladder. We take dept ops to do firefighting! If we want to take auto extrication, we can take the NYS class. Dont keep us in the dark. Our first priority is to keep the residents in our town safe, and not to deplete our resourses in town where it matters! If your going to give us a rescue job tell us so we have the right tools, we dont know how the scene is going to be set up (ie: person under a car for use of airbags, or an overturned vehicle, a 2 car mva, or even an mci)
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Post by squad5 on Apr 24, 2006 16:15:07 GMT -5
I think most of you misunderstood what I was trying to say. I happen to think the NCFSA is one of the best around anywhere, and most of the Chiefs that teach there are among the best. I am talking about logistical proplems. As for the grump dispatcher, maybe you are a better dispatcher than chief, but you got the grumpy part down pretty good!
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Post by PWFD1115 on Apr 24, 2006 16:34:19 GMT -5
OWCH!
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Post by LT32 on Apr 24, 2006 19:11:29 GMT -5
I think everybody is jumping at the chance to bitch on this one I agree with Grumpy try it and see what happens. Pwfd1115 and lt3a you guys have 2 ladders and over 300 members you will not be depleting your district if you send 2 eng and 1 ladder to fire school. As far as departments that only have 1 ladder than auto M/A is in order for house or building fires not auto alarms if your district is surrounded by water (which offhand I cant think of any without a neighboring dept nearby squad 5 which dept are you from) than have someone stand by for 3 hours. Remember almost all engines in the county have ladders on them and forcible entry tools for that quick grab until a ladder truck gets there. I am all for training without knowing and planning what you are going into treat it as that general alarm for an unknown type fire.
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 24, 2006 19:31:29 GMT -5
Yes I am good at being grumpy... no, I am not, nor do I ever wish to be a chief. Dealing with human stupidity as a dispatcher made me this way. I have no desire to be a chief babysitter.
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Post by PWFD1115 on Apr 24, 2006 22:58:15 GMT -5
lt32 it is easy for you to say that. roslyn 2 depts! (should be 1 but i wont get into that) has 5 ladder trucks, more then 5 engines and how many tools?
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Post by LT32 on Apr 24, 2006 23:34:24 GMT -5
1115
We have 5 ladder/engines 3 engines and maybe 6 tools and half your membership
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Post by Chief241B on Apr 25, 2006 9:42:30 GMT -5
Wow talk about cry-baby bitching.
The DEPARTMENT OPERATIONS is not the propane course, or auto extrication. It is FIRES in STRUCTURES !So not knowing what to bring is a b-s excuse.
How many departments if they know they are doing the commercial part put extra 2 1/2 hose packs on the rigs only for that night? Or if they are doing the tower or the warehouse they throw an extra saw on the rig? WHY?
Do you do that when a REAL fire happens in your district? Of course not !
The idea behind Dept Operations is to train and operate at these structures as you would back home. As a Chief I think the idea of going out to Bethpage with 2 engines, Ladder, and a Heavy Rescue and then staging and being called to what ever they throw at you is great.
I think the more realism there is the better. Company officers are going to think on their feet. Chiefs are going to have to develop a game plan. ETC.... This is what happens at a REAL FIRE !!
Think about all the different props they have out there just for Dept Ops. Residential / Commercial props (Tower) , Commercial props (Warehouse, Taxpayer), Residential ( Garden Apts., Dwelling), Basements (Taxpayer, Dwelling).
Now I do not know what the big deal if a certain piece of apparatus goes to the fire academy that night and has to get parked because it wasn't used. The equipment and tools on it will be used by the members. I can tell you the my Dept has 7 engines, at ahouse fire most of them are gonna get parked somewhere.
Now about the Truck Co's. If your dept only has one ladder whether it is a Tower of Stick it should go to the academy. Contact a neighboring dept set up automatic mutual aid or standby etc. It works all you have to do it ask. Can't get a truck, need an engine let me know, maybe we can help, pm me.
In a case where the dept has 2 ladders, tower & stick, send what ever piece you want they both can do the job at either residential or commercial, Think about it. If one of them was out of service in your district the other one would respond and do the job.
I think the Fire academy staff is trying to make things as realistic as they can. Just like anything the changes, someone is always going to disagree.
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 25, 2006 9:51:41 GMT -5
Couldn't have said it any better. Thanks Chief.
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Post by squad5 on Apr 25, 2006 10:47:33 GMT -5
Wow you must be the man. Nobody would have thought of any of that stuff you wrote. Did it ever occur to you that a tower and a stick are different and that both of the neighboring dept's did dept opts the same nights because of scheduling conflicts. And we do go to dept opts and use what is on our rigs all the time without adding things.
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Post by squad5 on Apr 25, 2006 10:49:18 GMT -5
dont bother replying, im done with this topic.
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Post by rhc5928 on Apr 25, 2006 11:19:02 GMT -5
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Post by Chief241B on Apr 25, 2006 11:26:00 GMT -5
Wow you must be the man. Nobody would have thought of any of that stuff you wrote. Did it ever occur to you that a tower and a stick are different and that both of the neighboring dept's did dept opts the same nights because of scheduling conflicts. And we do go to dept opts and use what is on our rigs all the time without adding things. Be the man? This whole topic was started to get opinions (and yes everyone has one) And I stated mine and right away got to try to start a pissing match. Not even worth fighting about. Be safe. |
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Post by grumpydispatcher on Apr 25, 2006 11:29:45 GMT -5
If you read his posts from this topic, Squad5 was obviously looking to bitch. No matter what anyone said, it wasn't good enough for him. He was apparently all knowing.
As I said before chief... your posting was 100% right.
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